LISBON TREATY VOTE NO

Indeed, but surely it will get worse If we piss off our big powerful freinds, just because we are small minded enough to vote no to spite the governing parties!
There is no sense in that! It's not only Fianna Fáil and the greens asking us to vote yes, It's the opposition parties aswell! And IBEC (Irish business and employers confederation)
They have nothing political to gain!
It seems that anyone who has taken the time to research what we are voting for, Will vote YES
It also seems most self employed people will vote YES, Maybe because they can how hard it is to run a company, never mind a country!
Hopefully genuine common sense will prevail this time round!
Regarding the foreigners, We are all over the world, A big chunk of us are genuine illegal immegrant in the USA, and Work needed doing!
Although the EU certainly helped the Celtec Tiger, But our cheap and effective Education system hugely contributed also,
We used to be and, some of us still are very useful people,
A positive mental attitude will help us get there again, Looking to blame some one and general negativity only leads to bad things!
Dan
 
[quote author=forester sti link=topic=17731.msg217963#msg217963 date=1252356695]
Indeed, but surely it will get worse If we p**s off our big powerful freinds, just because we are small minded enough to vote no to spite the governing parties!
There is no sense in that! It's not only Fianna Fáil and the greens asking us to vote yes, It's the opposition parties aswell! And IBEC (Irish business and employers confederation)
They have nothing political to gain!
It seems that anyone who has taken the time to research what we are voting for, Will vote YES
It also seems most self employed people will vote YES, Maybe because they can how hard it is to run a company, never mind a country!
Hopefully genuine common sense will prevail this time round!
Regarding the foreigners, We are all over the world, A big chunk of us are genuine illegal immegrant in the USA, and Work needed doing!
Although the EU certainly helped the Celtec Tiger, But our cheap and effective Education system hugely contributed also,
We used to be and, some of us still are very useful people,
A positive mental attitude will help us get there again, Looking to blame some one and general negativity only leads to bad things!
Dan
[/quote]

:clap: :clap:

completely agree
 
Lies, propaganda and ignorance. IF you think we can survive without the EU you are seriously mistaken.
 
As above, no real reasons to vote no. Its scaremongering, the no campaigners are spreading lies.

Even seen a taxi today with a sign saying "Irsh Taxi Driver, Vote No to Lisbon" plastered on the side of his car.

What the fcuk difference is it going to make to a taxi driver? No offence intended to Taxi drivers by the way.

I will be voting yes but something tells me that the amount of people trying to p**s off the government by voting no might outway the yes vote.

And then all we will be is an oversized golf course on the edge of Europe.

Do the sensible thing and vote yes for fcuk sake
 
[quote author=20vbzr link=topic=17731.msg218547#msg218547 date=1252509054]
And then all we will be is an oversized golf course on the edge of Europe.

Do the sensible thing and vote yes for fcuk sake
[/quote]

+ 1

We'll be a lot more fooked if we vote no... NO campaign is all bullshit and lies!
 
[quote author=JAMIE-TYPERV6 link=topic=17731.msg218584#msg218584 date=1252512536]
[quote author=20vbzr link=topic=17731.msg218547#msg218547 date=1252509054]
And then all we will be is an oversized golf course on the edge of Europe.

Do the sensible thing and vote yes for fcuk sake
[/quote]

+ 1

We'll be a lot more fooked if we vote no... NO campaign is all bullshit and lies!


[/quote]
No freekin' way.I want to keep my rights to self determination,thanks very much. I don't need Germany deciding whats best for me.As for being fookd without Europe take Switzerland,Finland & Iceland who have growth rates double the rest of Europe at the moment.The only difference is they have real politicians having the balls to make decisions unlike our lot at the minute.And before anyone says 'Iceland and banks' in the same sentence,yes they frigged up but they learned from it and are sorting out their own mess,while still achieving growth and record breaking tourism.We could learn a lot from them.
 
Bump for the no vote, the no vote will not change much as to how were placed now in europe,
we will not be kicked out of europe, but if we vote yes there goes your freedom to decide on
anything so hopefully it goes to the no, but there must be about 80 yes posters to 20 no
posters average, so how much did that cost for a pointless vote witch has already been taken :angry1:
 
Actually if we continue wih the current format then we, along with other smaller countries, will lose our european commisioner as that is the plan if we remain with the current treaty. Therefore we will in fact be governed by someone else if we vote no. Under the lisbon treaty, we retain a commissioner and get to have a say in how europe is governed in the future.

You are right in one aspect though, we will not be kicked out of europe with a no vote but we will become the outcasts of europe. Why would they bother continuing to support a country that cant even ratify a treaty thats in their best interest? We need all the help we can get from europe to get us out of recession because our government certainly won't be able to do it. Germany and the likes have already started to recover and here we are still swimming in it.

Don't use this vote to say F**k you to the goverment as you are only shooting yourself in the foot.

Vote YES!!!
 
We have to take into account investor confidence. We are giving away nothing as far as I can see but a no vote will give the perception that we are opting out. We need to be seen as forward thinking EUROPEANS presenting our selfs as a gateway to euro markets. We have no industry, very few natural resources in terms of economic strength...you can't compare use to Iceland for starters they have basically free energy resources. Finland have oil, also a world leader in telecommunications, and Switzerland is one of the wealthiest countries per capita on the planet, they have untold fortunes in their banks and huge tax's.

As far as Germany deciding whats best thats completely untrue. Check the FACTS before spouting your boll0x. 15 of the 27 states must vote to rectify any changes. That kind of scaremongering is what is winding me up the most. I listen to rational arguments from no voters everyone seems to be making good points...but lies and misinformation is leading the no campaign down a slippery path.

for example

"Do not vote 'yes'. If you do,the following will happen
1. You will never be asked your opinion again on anything - bullsh!t
2. Germany will be running Europe(Hitler will have one)- bullsh!t again they only have a weighted vote in certain situations...have you ever heard of Italy or france?
3. Young people of Ireland will be conscripted into a european army(good for employment i suppose)-- absolutle lies wwe have been garnuteed this in the new treaty this was the reason I voted no for the first one.
4. We will be forced to pay back every cent we got from Europe to help the newer states-- what is this based on?
5. We can look forward to carbon tax,house tax and EU slush fund tax as well as our existing taxes.-- carbon tax is on the way any how expect it next budget.
6. Employers will be able to bring in foreign workers and replace you as they are cheaper-- employers can already do this.
7. The assurance that the politians have given are verbal and not worth the paper they are written on.If they had done any change to the treaty it would have to be repassed by all states again.---thats your opinion.
8. All surveys carried out in Europe said the treaty would not have been passed in any country,only we had the protection of our constitution, given to us by our ancestors.This will overwrite any choice we had..."all surveys" can you back any of this up?
 
@ Dagnut.I deal only in the facts my friend.No interest in a debate.Thats what the politicians specialise in.You have already decided and i would fight for you to have your opinion.Sadly it won't matter if treaty goes through.
 
Facts? you haven't stated one fact..I would like you to substantiate even one of yours points. Forget about the treaty just provide one piece of evidence to back up what your saying.
You can't come on a thread debating the treaty spouting a load of crazy talk about hitler and irish people being forced into an army and then turn around and say you have no intertest in debate.
No interest in debate but plenty of interest in scaremongering, that seems to be the basis of the whole NO campaign. Your right about opinion but it needs to have some basis in reality.
 
[quote author=gonzogicker link=topic=17731.msg222918#msg222918 date=1253525585]
@ Dagnut.I deal only in the facts my friend.No interest in a debate.Thats what the politicians specialise in.You have already decided and i would fight for you to have your opinion.Sadly it won't matter if treaty goes through.
[/quote]
 
[quote author=gonzogicker link=topic=17731.msg222922#msg222922 date=1253526800]
[quote author=gonzogicker link=topic=17731.msg222918#msg222918 date=1253525585]
@ Dagnut.I deal only in the facts my friend.No interest in a debate.Thats what the politicians specialise in.You have already decided and i would fight for you to have your opinion.Sadly it won't matter if treaty goes through.
[/quote]
[/quote]

Ah now I get you...why didnt you say that the first time..well you have me convinced..no vote from me!
 
[quote author=gonzogicker link=topic=17731.msg222922#msg222922 date=1253526800]
[quote author=gonzogicker link=topic=17731.msg222918#msg222918 date=1253525585]
@ Dagnut.I deal only in the facts my friend.No interest in a debate.Thats what the politicians specialise in.You have already decided and i would fight for you to have your opinion.Sadly it won't matter if treaty goes through.
[/quote]
[/quote]

Ah Come On Eoin - at least have a go!

In fairness to Dagnut, it's obvious that some of your points are nowhere near facts, ( e.g. 1. You will never be asked your opinion again on anything). If you would like a No vote then you should make your "facts" more like real facts, otherwise you're discrediting the No side!

In my opinion like :smile:
 
Does anyone know where the NO Campaign are getting there facts from ?

The 1.84 minimum wage thing like ? or the faming familys been put out of business ?

The more no posters i see the more i wonder wtf are they on about and nobody on No campaign can give me a straight answer either ?
 
ill be voting no its a joke that we have to vote again :mooner: whats gonna happen if we gat another no vote 3rd time lucky :hammerhead:
i think we will get a yes this time around because of peoples fear over the recession
 
[quote author=tommy 555 link=topic=17731.msg223030#msg223030 date=1253555303]
Does anyone know where the NO Campaign are getting there facts from ?

The 1.84 minimum wage thing like ? or the faming familys been put out of business ?

The more no posters i see the more i wonder wtf are they on about and nobody on No campaign can give me a straight answer either ?


[/quote]

the figure of €1.84 is got by averaging the current minimum minimum wage of the countries that may be joining the EU in the future. so absolutely nothing but scare mongering.



[quote author=johnk555 link=topic=17731.msg223035#msg223035 date=1253556811]
ill be voting no its a joke that we have to vote again :mooner: whats gonna happen if we gat another no vote 3rd time lucky :hammerhead:
i think we will get a yes this time around because of peoples fear over the recession
[/quote]

this treaty has nothing to do with the recession or the government, and although i see what you are saying, if people decide to piss off the government by voting no, it will only be self destructive. we are voting again as most people didnt have the correct info first time around, but all issues have no been clarified for the country.

the only people on talk shows representing the no-vote are nut jobs scare mongering the public. one guy was a uk MEP and said we should vote no. When asked why he gave a dose of sh1t reply and then said fine, vote yes if you want to be ruled by Brits. He said this as he knew it would get the backs up of some people. I have yet to see any party that has any valid reason to vote no, or even to see anyone who cares for the future of this country stand up for the no vote publicly.

ALL government parties support yes vote
IFA support yes vote
IBEC support yes vote
 
[quote author=sligo_dave link=topic=17731.msg223077#msg223077 date=1253564745]
[quote author=tommy 555 link=topic=17731.msg223030#msg223030 date=1253555303]
Does anyone know where the NO Campaign are getting there facts from ?

The 1.84 minimum wage thing like ? or the faming familys been put out of business ?

The more no posters i see the more i wonder wtf are they on about and nobody on No campaign can give me a straight answer either ?


[/quote]

the figure of €1.84 is got by averaging the current minimum minimum wage of the countries that may be joining the EU in the future. so absolutely nothing but scare mongering.



[quote author=johnk555 link=topic=17731.msg223035#msg223035 date=1253556811]
ill be voting no its a joke that we have to vote again :mooner: whats gonna happen if we gat another no vote 3rd time lucky :hammerhead:
i think we will get a yes this time around because of peoples fear over the recession
[/quote]

this treaty has nothing to do with the recession or the government, and although i see what you are saying, if people decide to p**s off the government by voting no, it will only be self destructive. we are voting again as most people didnt have the correct info first time around, but all issues have no been clarified for the country.

the only people on talk shows representing the no-vote are nut jobs scare mongering the public. one guy was a uk MEP and said we should vote no. When asked why he gave a dose of sh1t reply and then said fine, vote yes if you want to be ruled by Brits. He said this as he knew it would get the backs up of some people. I have yet to see any party that has any valid reason to vote no, or even to see anyone who cares for the future of this country stand up for the no vote publicly.

ALL government parties support yes vote
IFA support yes vote
IBEC support yes vote


[/quote]

Exactly, I voted no the first time but all our original fears have been addressed. The no campaigners can't present any facts or valid reasons except wild assumptions based on nothing and for that reason I am voting yes. The minimum wage is not set by the EU and never has been.
 
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